In conversation with: Professor Charles Egbu

Q: You've worked in higher education for almost 35 years. What have been some of the biggest changes you’ve seen around race and diversity within the higher education sector?

A: I did my undergraduate degree in 1986. At that time, very few Black students were moving into the higher education sector. One of the things that strikes me now is the increasing number of Black students participating in higher education.

There’s also been an increasing recognition of race, of inequity, and of lack of representation – for example, in the recent work done by Universities UK and Advance HE. Whilst there have been scholars working on race equity for years, it is only recently that the sector has responded collectively.

I think we’re beginning to see some form of honesty around issues of race and diversity, but we need to make some bold changes. It’s not just about saying that racism exists; we need to be more proactive and commit to becoming anti-racist institutions. At my institution, Leeds Trinity University, we’ve achieved the Bronze award in the Race Equality Charter. We recognise the challenge and have a plan to deal with it.

While there have been some changes in the sector, progress has been slow. We need to be urgent about this work.

Q: How should institutions across the UK actively work together towards racial equality?

A: I always say the first thing we need to do is to recognise that there is a problem.

Universities like mine must, in my view, put together a challenging and inclusive action plan with measurable targets. We need to be accountable and transparent. And no one has all the answers, so we need to collaborate with each other.

Leadership has an important role to play: university leaders need to set the direction of travel, the tone and the language on racial equity within their institution.

But no one individual in an institution can do everything. That’s why there needs to be change in the cultural framework of our universities. And I have to say, we’ve been talking about this for too long. I've been involved in lots of these discussions over the past 35 years.

Q: What have been some of the biggest challenges for you in tackling issues such as racial inequality in higher education?

A: Some people may not understand the urgency of the issue and what it means to those with lived experience of racism. Perhaps that explains why, at times, progress is sluggish.

I think we also need to remember that there’s so much work to be done, from ethnicity degree awarding gaps to pay gaps. The notion of taking responsibility, authority and having accountability is also a challenge.

And the final challenge is that the world around us is changing. Too often we are confronted with what are perceived to be much more worthy issues, but we shouldn’t lose sight of the urgent need to tackle racial inequality.

Q: How did you find the transition from being a professor to becoming a vice-chancellor, and what advice do you have for Black academics interested in taking up senior roles?

A: In a way, I could say I've been really, really blessed.

I struggled to get sponsorship to do a PhD, but I was so determined to do so. My career took me from being a PhD student to becoming a research associate, senior research associate, lecturer, senior lecturer, associate professor, professor, head of school, dean of school, pro-vice-chancellor, and finally vice-chancellor.

It was tough. But my advice to other Black academics is to never give up. You need to remain focused and have resilience, always look at the positive and believe in the premise that, in every adversity, there is a seed of equal or greater prosperity. Even if you are knocked down, let that be an opportunity to even move forward.

Look for those who will mentor you – as vice-chancellor, I’m even mentored by other vice-chancellors. At Leeds Trinity, last year we launched a new diversity mentoring scheme for staff in partnership with a number of higher education institutions across Yorkshire. The U-Connect scheme provides cross-institutional mentoring to colleagues, to provide staff from diverse background with career support, development and progression.

It’s important for people like me to have role models. While there aren’t many of us, we need to give more than we get. That's why I want to maximise every opportunity I get to support those who will come after me.

Q: How can we ensure there are more Black academics in senior positions at UK universities?

A: That’s a question people like me have been grappling with for over 25 years.

We need to understand that there is real underrepresentation of Black academics in senior positions. In 2018–19, 535 staff were employed as managers, directors or senior officials at UK universities. Of those 535, 475 were white, 25 were Asian, of mixed heritage or of another ethnicity, and there were no Black people recorded. Even if one or two of these members of staff were Black, the number was so small that it was not statistically representative.

So, people ask me, Charles, you’re one of the only Black vice-chancellors in the UK and in Europe – how do we get another Charles?

I say we need to think about the academic pipeline. And to do that, we need to look at the basics – for example, the ethnicity degree awarding gap. How do we make sure our undergraduate students have a sense of belonging and graduate with good honours degrees?

The low numbers of Black students continuing onto postgraduate courses in the sector is also an issue. At Leeds Trinity, we provide five scholarships for PhD students, and we’ve made sure that one of those is ringfenced for a Black or Black (mixed) scholar from the UK. But across the board, there are still few opportunities for funding Black students looking to do a PhD.

Q: What does Black History Month mean to you?

A: It's hugely important. It speaks to the importance of celebrating and recognising and promoting the efforts and the contribution of Black people to all areas of life here in Britain.

It's also important as an opportunity to continuously raise the importance of inclusivity and diversity. While I take the view that this is not something we only have to do in the month of October, Black History Month allows us to continuously raise that importance of inclusivity and diversity, to promote equity and social justice, and to challenge inequality and prejudice. And for me, it affords us the opportunity to build positive, supportive communities.